posted Oct-22-2007 03:07 PM            

Mailbox Bummer, man! What was your weekly mileage. It seems to me often people who get these kinds of problems haven't beaten the hell out of their legs enough in training. I would bet it's less a strength issue and more that your legs aren't "seasoned" yet for the demands of the marathon. More importantly, congrats on toughing it out and welcome to the club!!! [BTW did you go out with the 3:10 pacers? I did. Maybe we were right next to each other and didn't even know it?]

Thanks everyone for your encouraging words. It really did make me feel better. It's interesting--looking at the results, the times were generally slow for this marathon. I came in 60th last year and this year my 3:25 would have put me in 35th! It was hot (I was so hung up on the stitch I didn't even notice!) and there was a strong blustery headwind in our face for the last 7+ miles. Oh well.

The good news is I feel really good today. I am about as sore as I was after my last half marathon. The thing that is currently aggravating me the most is my side where I had the stitch! I even elipticalled for 20 minutes on a very low resistance setting and stretched thoroughly. That's a plus. My brain has been churning wondering about a marathon in January, but then again I did swear them off forever just a little over 24 hours ago I'll have to think about it.

I posted a sort-of race report on my blog if you're curious: http://notpeppery.blogspot.com/2007/10/me-and-my-stitch.html

As for the week leading up to the marathon, here's what I did:

M--AM 6 easy (8:24), PM 4 easy (8:24)

Tu--AM 10 including 2 mi w/u and then 8 mi wave alternating MP and EZ: 6:55, 7:54, 6:50, 7:48, 6:48, 7:54, 6:40; PM 3 very slow (9:30)

We--6 very very slow with no watch(10:00ish I'd guess) My shin hurt pretty bad after this run and gave me a scare. I think I just ran too slow.

Th--off day!

Fr--AM 3 easy (8:35); PM 3 easy (8:24)

Sa: 4 easy including 5 x 100 strides (7:51). Ready to roll! Oh well...

Total before marathon: 39

Good weeks everyone!

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posted Oct-22-2007 03:29 PM            

I also think it is interesting you are not as sore. I think the high mileage supporting you and good pacing really helped with that.

As far as the stitch goes, you are certainly not alone. I was plagued with them for months last Fall. It seemed they stopped my in my tracks during every 10K I did and during several training runs. I actually did a 16 miler this winter and the stitch was crazy brutal like you described. And it hurt for 2-3 days afterwards! Nuts. But it did go away. I find they come on for me with downhills, wind, drinking while running, and picking up the pace quickly. Especially when I combine those factors.

Congrats on an awesome race and for finding the toughness to sprint in strong. Just finishing hard can make it all worthwhile.

So did you get a sweet award for your AG win?

Congrats Congrats Congrats!!

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posted Oct-22-2007 04:02 PM            

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posted Oct-22-2007 05:01 PM               

I have decided to run the Jacksonville marathon and shoot for something in the 2:26-2:28 range.

Josh

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posted Oct-22-2007 07:29 PM            

TSG- what do you look like if you don't mind me asking? I did start out with the pace group- although I let him go ahead a little early until catching back up around 16 because I thought the pacer went out a little too quick and I wanted to stay out of the scrum of fellow 3:10 hopefuls a bit.
I didn't notice more than a few girls in the group, so I might remember you.

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posted Oct-22-2007 08:17 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Mailbox Head:
I felt like I had a pretty good mileage base. 45-50 mpw going into a 70 mpw 24 week pfitzinger plan. I lowered the mileage on a few days, but for the most part I kept close to the prescription. I did quite a bit of hill training and I felt like I was well hydrated, but it's possible I didn't get quite as much water as I should have.
Either way, I learned a lot, and I'm formulating a plan for a good year next year. I'll probably shift to a strange high mileage 5k plan for the first part of next year, then shift my focus back to Columbus around June.

TSG- what do you look like if you don't mind me asking? I did start out with the pace group- although I let him go ahead a little early until catching back up around 16 because I thought the pacer went out a little too quick and I wanted to stay out of the scrum of fellow 3:10 hopefuls a bit.
I didn't notice more than a few girls in the group, so I might remember you.

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MB--did you run the long runs easy the whole way or did you pick it up to GMP at the end or do fast finish long runs? 70 MPW should be enough, I'd think. Hmmm.

I think there were just two of us women w/ the 3:10 pacers: a blond woman with an orange singlet and arm warmers and then me--a brunette with a light blue/purple top and black shorts.

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posted Oct-23-2007 08:15 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by JSM:
I was a DNF at Chicago...last pace for 2:22 by 4 miles and I knew it wasn't going to get any better.

I have decided to run the Jacksonville marathon and shoot for something in the 2:26-2:28 range.

Josh

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AH, another Chicago casualty. Sorry to hear about it, but it looks like you made a smart choice. I have updated our schedule - GOOD LUCK in JAX!

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posted Oct-23-2007 08:16 AM            

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posted Oct-23-2007 09:15 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by thereshegoes:
MB--did you run the long runs easy the whole way or did you pick it up to GMP at the end or do fast finish long runs? 70 MPW should be enough, I'd think. Hmmm.

I think there were just two of us women w/ the 3:10 pacers: a blond woman with an orange singlet and arm warmers and then me--a brunette with a light blue/purple top and black shorts.

---

I did most of my long runs as progression type runs, going from 8:15s to 7:45ish at the end to average 8 for them. I did get down to Mp a few times, but I'll definitely mix it up a little more for the next time. I don't have plans to make another attempt til next Columbus, so I've got plenty of time to experiment and figure out what works.

I do think I lined up almost right next to you if you were a few rows back from the pacer before the gun sounded...

Good luck to everyone else still on the list for this fall.

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posted Oct-23-2007 03:53 PM               

I am in the midst of rest & recovery now and will eventually strengthen some of the weaker joints to get more balance. I am looking forward to a few shorter (7,8 mile), more fun races in the next few months.

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posted Oct-24-2007 06:44 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by runninlaw:

Berlin
uli - 2:36 2:39

).][/B]

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Hi runninlaw!

Thanks for your race report, I truly enjoyed it!

My marathon has been a while ago, but after being sick and travelling and then reading your report, I kinda felt like posting a racereport, too.
So for anyone who's interested, it's here:

http://www.coolrunning.com/forums/Forum8/HTML/010717.shtml

Good luck to all the racers, especially those in NY. I'm really envious as I have been there the last two years. I maybe move to NYC next year and will therefore have no excuse not to line up in 08!

cheers
uli

[This message has been edited by uli f (edited Oct-24-2007).]

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posted Oct-25-2007 10:42 AM               

Week of Oct 7-13
S: Steamtown Marathon
M: 1 ez; Cycle 15
T: 5 ez; Cycle 16
W: rest
R: 5.5 ez
F: 4 ez (4x strides)
S: 13 ez

Totals:
Run 54.5
Cycle 31

Week of Oct 14-20
S: 7 miles ez
M: 4 ez (with 4x strides)
T: 9 miles, with 3mi at I-pace (6x800m; with 400m recovery jogs); Cycle 10
W: 5 ez
R: 6 ez on trails
F: Cycle 10
S: 7 ez (with 6x strides); Cycle 14

Ave I-pace for the Tuesday workout: 5:50-5:55

Totals:
Run 38
Cycle 34

Week of Oct 21-27
S: 9.5 miles, with 5k race (18:58 ); Cycle 11
M: Swim 1000m, Cycle 5
T: 8.5 ez (with 4x strides)
W: 7 miles, with 3 @ T-pace (4x1200m; with 1 min rests) Ave T-pace = 6:24
R: 4 ez (planned)
F: rest
S: 3 ez, with strides (planned)

32 miles planned for the week.

I didn't get a good long run 16+ since Steamtown, but I'm enthused with the three quality workouts. I ran hard at the 5k race, but the wind and hilly course was less-than ideal.

I'm feeling really good and the weather forecast is cold. I'm ready to rock!

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posted Oct-25-2007 12:41 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by rootsrunner:

I'm feeling really good and the weather forecast is cold. I'm ready to rock!

---

Your forecast looks awesome -- 38/47, light winds, and 60% cloud cover. Rock on!

I did two marathons separated by 4 weeks last year and took the opposite approach -- no workouts, but ran 18, 20, 18 on the weekends in between. I went from a what-the-hell-happened 3:56 to a what-i-was-expecting 3:43. I'm not sure what approach I'll take if I have to go to my backup marathon again this year. Best not to think about it :-)

7 miles w/2 at MP went pretty well yesterday. MP miles were 7:29 @160bpm and 7:23 @ 167 bpm. 7:26 is my target BQ pace and my first two miles of a marathon are usually at about those heart rates, so it looks like I'm right on the hairy edge. I had to hold myself back on my easy 40 minute run today -- can't wait until Sunday.

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posted Oct-26-2007 08:45 AM            

rootsrunner - OK, I'll play too and provide my crazy schedule. I have been looking all over for what others have done, so I am assuming there is some value to sharing. Boy I hope it works out....

Week 3:
Sunday: Twin Cities Marathon - 3:53
Monday - off
Tuesday - off
Wed - 4.25 recovery
Thurs - rest
Fri - 5.2 (8:38)
Sat - rest

Total: 35.65

Week 2:
Sunday - 8.6 (9:10)
Monday - rest
Tuesday - 5 progression with last mile at 7:17 pace
Wed - 15 (9:07)
Thurs - rest
Fri - 8 w/6 striders
Sat - 5 recovery

Total: 41.6

Week 3:
Sunday - 10 easy
Monday - rest
Tuesday - 5 easy + elliptical
Wed - 7 w/2 at MP
Thurs - rest
Friday - 5
Sat - 4

Total planned: 31

Every day in there I did pilates, sit-ups, push-ups and general stretching to get the legs back in order. So far everything feels really good. We'll see how it goes. I contracted some nasty stomach bug late Wednesday night that is hanging on still today. I hope it goes away ASAP. I'm not sure what I expect from the race. My plan is to go out easy and on my own. I know pacers like to bank time up front and I don't want to fall into that trap. I hope to go our running 8:00s - 8:10s.

GOALS:
Perfect day: 3:25 - 3:30
Good Day: PR - 3:37:17 or under
I'd be ok with: BQ 3:40 - oops - I will be 35 next year so I guess it is 3:45 now....
I'll admittedly be bummed, but proud for finishing 2 marathons in 3 weeks: finishing

So, as you can see, I have tried to set myself up for success no matter the outcome. While I would love a brand new PR, this is new territory for me. Wish me luck as I drive through Chicago tomorrow (yuck) - I did it yesterday and it was a nightmare.....(it didn't help that my nephew threw up all over my brand new car just as we got to the 10 mph and constantly riding the brakes traffic).

Good luck to all of you racing this weekend!!

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posted Oct-26-2007 09:39 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by runninlaw:
[
GOALS:
[b]Perfect day: 3:25 - 3:30
Good Day: PR - 3:37:17 or under
I'd be ok with: BQ 3:40 - oops - I will be 35 next year so I guess it is 3:45 now....
I'll admittedly be bummed, but proud for finishing 2 marathons in 3 weeks: finishing

So, as you can see, I have tried to set myself up for success no matter the outcome. While I would love a brand new PR, this is new territory for me. Wish me luck as I drive through Chicago tomorrow (yuck) - I did it yesterday and it was a nightmare.....(it didn't help that my nephew threw up all over my brand new car just as we got to the 10 mph and constantly riding the brakes traffic).

Good luck to all of you racing this weekend!![/B]

---

I wish you the best of luck. I hope you have a wonderful day and a perfect race. I highly advise going out slow--like C goal pace slow and see how you feel around 3 miles. Just let yourself get into a groove and roll with it. I wouldn;t push the pace from this groove until 20. Of course you know this, but it doesn't hurt to hear it one more time

I give you a lot of credit. On Monday I was all about bouncing right back and getting out there ASAP to go after it again, but as the week has worn on and I just feel kind of poopy--my legs aren't wrecked but that doesn't mean I don't need some recovery time, if from nothing else than the last two months of nonstop high mileage training!

I am inspired by your drive to get out there and do it! I can't wait to track you and see you finish off a great race and a magnificent training cycle. If nothing else you should feel so proud just to be where you are right now. GOOD LUCK!!!!!!!!!

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posted Oct-26-2007 10:43 AM            

I'm sure you do need some recovery. You didn't hit your goal, but you were VERY close. Some of us, *cough*, were a half hour off! While the high mileage you did probably helped your recovery a lot, I'm sure you didn't leave a whole lot out on the course. Recover well and continue looking forward. You have some awesome stuff coming up in the next several weeks!

I look forward to seeing what marathon you choose to do next. Have you considered Jacksonville in Feb? That has a one mile stretch on the beach that may be windy, but otherwise looks good. Only 2 *hills* (it is the bridge over the intracoastal). The only downside is that it is the inaugural running this spring so no idea how organization will be. AND it is a breast cancer event so may be more organized toward the big parade rather than faster runners. Just thoughts....

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posted Oct-26-2007 10:59 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by runninlaw:
tsg - thanks so much! And yeah, I know how I should go out, but I definitely appreciate the reminder.

I'm sure you do need some recovery. You didn't hit your goal, but you were VERY close. Some of us, *cough*, were a half hour off! While the high mileage you did probably helped your recovery a lot, I'm sure you didn't leave a whole lot out on the course. Recover well and continue looking forward. You have some awesome stuff coming up in the next several weeks!

I look forward to seeing what marathon you choose to do next. Have you considered Jacksonville in Feb? That has a one mile stretch on the beach that may be windy, but otherwise looks good. Only 2 *hills* (it is the bridge over the intracoastal). The only downside is that it is the inaugural running this spring so no idea how organization will be. AND it is a breast cancer event so may be more organized toward the big parade rather than faster runners. Just thoughts....

---

I've considered every marathon in the next 7 months! haha. I've decided to take my time and do something later in the spring. Basically, it's between Boston and Cleveland right now, leaning toward Cleveland. Besides being on my home turf, that will give me a great opportunity to run lots of shorter races in the meantime, which I look forward too. Plus, takes the pressure off to jump back in RIGHT NOW, which as we all know can lead to burning out and injury and fun stuff like that. So, for now I'm putzing a few miles here and there and not worrying about it.

But seriously, go out there this weekend and be confident we're all cheering for you!! I CANNOT wait to hear all about it

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posted Oct-26-2007 11:58 AM            

I have been training for 20+ weeks now and don't race until the 10th. I finished my last 20 miler Saturday of the 3 scheduled. I felt pretty strong and I pressed pace for the last 5 miles. My program only goes up to 50mpw and if you look at my goal you can see that I am not a "fast" runner. My goals are to finish, break 4 hours, and hit the 3:50.

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posted Oct-26-2007 12:13 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by HOSS1961:
Great racing guys.
I just started the taper and I am already getting a little loopy (no offense Loopy) wondering how to keep the nerves in check.
Any advice for the new guy?

I have been training for 20+ weeks now and don't race until the 10th. I finished my last 20 miler Saturday of the 3 scheduled. I felt pretty strong and I pressed pace for the last 5 miles. My program only goes up to 50mpw and if you look at my goal you can see that I am not a "fast" runner. My goals are to finish, break 4 hours, and hit the 3:50.

---

Reading this you could be me. I just finished a marathon earlier this month. My mileage peaked around 50mpw and my time goal was almost the same as yours, too.

Two weeks out I ran 45 miles with a LR of 15. One week out I ran 39 miles with a LR of 12. Marathon week I ran 19 miles prior to the race. I did cut back on intensity, only throwing in a few MP miles here and there. On marathon day I felt fresh and ready to go. I finished in 3:58 on a warm day (not Chicago warm, mid 70s at the finish).

I read some folks on this board saying that if your mileage isn't that high that you don't need to taper quite as severely. That sounded like good advice so I tried it and it worked for me. I was prepared to back off if I felt run down, but that never happened.

Hope that helps.

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posted Oct-26-2007 12:40 PM            

Good luck this weekend to all runners.

Runninlaw and rootsrunner - Since you 2 jumped on the multimarathon bandwagon after the meltdown day of 10/07, I thought I might join you. I just switched from the 1/2 to the full in Philly. I'll give it one last shot at another BQ. Good luck in GR.

Runninlaw - FYI - I just noticed that you don't have my time down for Chicago. I guess I had so much fun, I forgot to post it If you must know, I melted to a 4:43.

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My Profile

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posted Oct-26-2007 12:58 PM            

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posted Oct-26-2007 01:09 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by runninlaw:
[b]gregw - in what percentage do those HR numbers fall for you? I am tempted to wear my HR during this race, but I don't think it will be a good idea since I don't know what to expect from it. Most coaches say you race the marathon just under your LT - does that correspond with your numbers?

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In the four marathons that I've worn an HRM, my avg HR has been 172, 172, 173, and 173. My max is 200, so this is 86-86.5%. I've never had my LT tested, but I've run 10 milers at 182-184 avg heart rate. My PR is 69:49 and they say LT pace is what you can sustain for an hour, so 184 or so is probably close. I've also read the MR HR should be about 95% of LT HR and 172.25/183 is 94.3%, so it's pretty close.

My first miles will typically be something like 160, 167, 169, 170, ... I creep up to 172 about halfway and then hit the high 170's around mile 20 and usually hold there and slow down or sometimes push over 180.

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posted Oct-26-2007 01:10 PM            

jtv - sorry I missed that - did you have a race report? I added you for the full at Philly - good luck!!

gregw - thank you VERY much for the detailed HR info. Your numbers look very similar to mine. I may wear the thing afterall to see what it tells me post-race.

Thanks to everyone for the well wishes - hopefully we'll all get some nice racing weather this weekend! I for one am very excited!

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Me

Toenails are for wimps

[This message has been edited by runninlaw (edited Oct-26-2007).]

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