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Sub 20-Minute 5-K


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Author Topic:   Sub 20-Minute 5-K
sbiss75
Cool Runner
posted Feb-19-2006 12:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for sbiss75   Click Here to Email sbiss75     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
my opinion instead of doing 50 miles per week do 30 and do like 2 or 3 speed workout. Do like maybe a a mile times 2 or 3 at race pace, like do a 6:20 mile then take a 2 minute rest and so on. It builds up your confidence tremendously, aka i ran a 17:30 3 miles with jogs inbetween yet i never broke 19 on a 5k. Instead of just going for super mileage, just do some spead for ur 5k.

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aurang
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posted Feb-19-2006 02:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for aurang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Running 5k in under 20 minutes is about being able to run under 20 minutes for 5k, not the belief that one can 5k in less than 20 minutes. I first broke 20 a long time ago, but I did it by running more than I'd ever run and a lot of long, hard continuous efforts. I didn't really know what intervals were at the time, so I just ran hard (probably too hard) on days that I felt good, because that's what races were like.

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Viich
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posted Feb-19-2006 04:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Viich     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by aurang:
Running 5k in under 20 minutes is about being able to run under 20 minutes for 5k, not the belief that one can 5k in less than 20 minutes. I first broke 20 a long time ago, but I did it by running more than I'd ever run and a lot of long, hard continuous efforts. I didn't really know what intervals were at the time, so I just ran hard (probably too hard) on days that I felt good, because that's what races were like.

Agreed. The key workouts are tempo runs and long runs. I wouldn't worry too much about intervals/repeats until you're almost to race day, unless you like them. To me the key to peak performance is lots of volume followed by an increase in speedwork, followed by a decrease in volume about a week before goal race. The unloading really seems to do something for me.

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KudzuRunner
Cool Runner
posted Feb-19-2006 10:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KudzuRunner   Click Here to Email KudzuRunner     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm a fan of tempo runs and long runs, but I'll respectfully disagree about what it takes to run a fast 5K. 5K race pace is in V02max territory for most of us, and for fast racing I think you've got to some of that sort of high intensity training for a solid month before a goal race. Waiting until a week before the race, in fact, is a recipe for trouble. Tempo runs aren't anywhere near 5K pace; they're at least 30 seconds/mile slower, and that's a crucial gap.

I do think, though, that 5K training doesn't have to mean going to a track. My own racing has been helped by three sorts of workouts:

1) hill repeats: both 3-4 x 3:00 hills and 5-6 x 1:30 hills (slightly faster and steeper). The first give you a good feel for race-intensity; very hard but not too hard. The second build a longer, springier stride.

2) 4-5 x 800 meters at slightly faster than 5K pace w/2-3 minute breaks. Develops comfort and economy at race pace +

3) Fartlek. For example, I'll run 5 miles out on rolling hills, moving from easy to threshold pace; take a 60 second break; then run back at threshold intensity, hitting the uphills hard and floating the flats and downhills. Take just enough rest to be ready to hit it hard. It's easy to overload on this one, but it works every pace and definitely stokes some serious animal aggression; also gives you a finishing kick, since some of the fast spurts are much faster than 5K pace.

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bspurrie
Cool Runner
posted Feb-20-2006 11:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for bspurrie     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I would like run under 20 again. A couple of years back I ran a 19:10 as a 35 year old. In high school I regularly ran under 17:00. But I took several years off.

I read a few of these posts and one of the things that strikes me is the mileage. I'm all for building a good base, but I really don't see why a person that runs 20 to 30MPW can not accomplish this. I have always gone with the philosophy that if you want to race at a certain pace than you need to get your body used to running at that pace. Of course gradually building the time through interval or other training.

When I ran my time my weekly mileage was 20 to 30 with a long run of 10 miles max. I was shooting for 6 minute pace for a 5K. I had one interval session each week. I started by doing 1/2 mile intervals at 6 min pace, after the interval I would slow down to around 10min pace for a minute. Started by doing three and incremented by one each week. Moved on to 3/4 mile intervals and eventually got to the point where I was doing intervals of 5 minutes @ 6 min pace followed by 1 minute of 8-10 min/mi pace. got up to six of these intervals. All the while my long run was 7-10 miles. Even in high school our longest run was 7 miles.

Now that may be the minimalist approach but it worked for me and I never got injured. It focuses on the quality of run approach versus the quantity. I'm sure there are many that can point out the weaknesses to this approach but, again it worked for me. Although I was not able to get the sub 6 min/mi pace I was shooting for I did beat my PR by over a minute and that's what it's all about right?

Bill S.

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bonniecs
Cool Runner
posted Apr-29-2006 06:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for bonniecs   Click Here to Email bonniecs     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Bump for Batfish/Brooktrout.

I just read through your recent race report and figured you might want to officially join the 20 minute club. Congrats.

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OldXCguy
Cool Runner
posted Apr-29-2006 06:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for OldXCguy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
How's everyone doing in their quest for sub-20 as we approach the height of the spring racing season? I think I may be getting close, based on recent workouts. I'll keep you posted. (I'm sure everyone will be sitting in front of their screens waiting to hear from me!)

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brook trout
Cool Runner
posted Apr-30-2006 12:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for brook trout   Click Here to Email brook trout     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh, wow - thanks bonniecs!

I had forgotten about this thread. Since the search button was removed, I figured it was dead...

Anyway, yeah - I did it - but it was as close as close can be (19:59!).

Here's my race report.

I think I can still nibble 10-20 seconds off that time at my current fitness, which I hope to do next week (to make my sub-20 PR a bit more convincing).

Anyway, thanks for noticing! Anyone still aspiring to this goal should keep this thread rolling - like Jim's doing with the sub-40 thread, just bump it up once a week or so.

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brook trout

my profile

[This message has been edited by brook trout (edited Apr-30-2006).]

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eager runner
Cool Runner
posted Apr-30-2006 06:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for eager runner   Click Here to Email eager runner     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
well I am close to it ran a 5k yesterday in 20:44.I did alright besides starting at a little to slow.also the race was a little long by about 200 yards or so, but it is early in the season. good luck to all of you.

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http://interwovendesign.com/kick/userdisplay.php3?username=eager%20runnermyprofile

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spkoest
Cool Runner
posted Apr-30-2006 07:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for spkoest     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi All,

Been watching this thread for awhile... for my first goal of this season is to break that 20 minute mark for the first time.
42 years old, 173, avg 40 mpw, had a couple good stretches of 50 mpw. Been running injury free for 2 years. First 5k of season yesterday and managed 19:49... yeah.. I might mention I run quite a few hills in my workouts but no speed work. I have achilles tendon issues that I have to constantly baby. The speed work kills them. Maybe I am try to go to fast when i try the speedwork. I think I am going to try to move to 60 mpw and and take the weight loss that will go with that and see what improvement I will see. Good luck everyone. (Even thought luck has nothing to do with it...)

steve

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ferranto
Member
posted May-08-2006 12:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ferranto   Click Here to Email ferranto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What's up!! I just stumbled upon this thread and I definitely want in...I'm 29, 5'10", 180 and have been running steadily for a little under a year. I ran my first 5K last fall/winter (a Turkey trot) and managed a 22:07, so I'm pretty far off the pace right now. I just got through a marathon training program (although I wasn't able to run the marathon due to injury) and was planning on a couple of months of basebuilding in order to get ready for the fall marathon season. However, I'm going to be mixing in some 5K's just to break up the monotony. I don't really have any speedwork planned for the coming months, but hopefully the base building will be enough to at least put me near 20:00, especially since I never really developed a good aerobic base to begin with.

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angrek
Cool Runner
posted May-10-2006 10:01 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for angrek   Click Here to Email angrek     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ok, I'm in too. I saw this thread a while ago and was jealous but I wasn't close enough to join in. I ran a 22:00 weekend before last to better my PR from the end of February PR of 24:57. Probably take me a couple months and I'm not sure how many 5K's we'll have here in Tampa mid-summer, but I'm aiming for it anyway. My goal was that after the race last week I would start moving into the 20-30 mpw range, start seriously working on my base, slowly extend my long runs, and move into marathoning, but I still want to time and set shorter run goals. It's hard to pass up a good challange anyway. Pretty confident that if I just move my base up a bit I should be able to hit it.

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Mah Profile

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dcv2002
Cool Runner
posted May-11-2006 01:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for dcv2002     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm also over in the 10K under 40 thread. I haven't run under 20 in a 5k yet. In a 5k race my PR is 21:50 last August. My 5K PR was set during a race last Sunday during a HalfMar. I did my 1st 5k in 20:50. My HM time (1:30) is about a 19:47 5k was looking at those calculators. My next 5k probably wont be until mid-to-end July. Hopefully, will be under 20 by then (and maybe even under 19). Just wanted to join the thread.

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bradman
Cool Runner
posted May-12-2006 02:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for bradman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I finally broke 20 last year, after a year of trying and some very annoying 20:03s and 20:04s. Broke it at 19:49, went down to 19:32 on the same course the following week, then dipped to 18:57 two weeks later before finally coming back to reality and finishing the year with 10 sub 20-races but nothing near sub-19 again. Ironically, my last race of the season last December was 20 flat and my first race this past Wednesday was also 20 flat. That hurts!

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ferranto
Member
posted May-16-2006 05:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ferranto   Click Here to Email ferranto     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I just ran a 3 miler this past Saturday and clocked in at 20:14, so I feel like I'm close...amazing what a little base building can do!!!! The best part about the race is how much better I felt while running it...it was a comfortably hard effort and I definitely had a good amount left in the tank (wish I would have known that...I probably would have gone out a little harder)

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MaineRunner2001
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posted Jun-05-2006 10:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for MaineRunner2001     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
When is your next goal 5K? What have you been doing? What do you plan to do before the race?

I am nine weeks away from my goal 5K - August 5.

In May I ran four tempo runs - one a week. Pace was between 7:17 and 7:22. It was over hilly roads.

I plan to build up to this workout: 6X880;3:13;3:13 - half mile repeats at goal 5K pace over the next 9 weeks. I will continue to run a 4-mile tempo run and an 8 to 10 mile "long" run each week. Every other mile will be slow - less than 75% max heart rate except a couple 80-100M striders one time per week (thanks Tchuck for the suggestion) Total miles per week: 30 to 34.

I would like to lose a couple pounds and then give it a shot. I am curious what others are doing.

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RunnerWbaby
Cool Runner
posted Jun-05-2006 12:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for RunnerWbaby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi all!
I'd love to join the club! I'm on the come back
from having a baby & will run in my 1st 5K
this Sat. It's been about 2 years and I'm finally
down to a good training weight again. I'm hoping
to run under 23 min. I haven't done any speed yet.
Just 30 - 50 min. easy runs with 6-8 striders after
5 days per week. I have been doing some hill work
as well (I live in the mts.of NC).

btw - I ran 19:50 about 6 years ago in Orlando.

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vellamike
Cool Runner
posted Jun-05-2006 01:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for vellamike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'd definately love to join this club! I've only been running a month. My 5k time is around 21:30 (not a race, just training runs).

My schedule is something like:

Mon:3-5M
Tue:Fartlek 5M
Wed:3-5M
Thur:6-7M
Fri:3-5M
Sat:6-10M

is this a fairly standard schedule?
should I include more speedwork?

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SaintCroixRunner
Cool Runner
posted Jun-05-2006 01:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SaintCroixRunner     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hey guys,
I started this thread so long ago and forgot about it...but...I managed to break the barrier about a month ago in 19:43, right out of a winter of base training at about 40mpw. The key was a consistent mileage buildup. I haven't reached speed work yet, so now I'm aiming to break 19. Maybe time for a next-step thread. I wish all of you the best in getting there, I'm sure many of you will be celebrating soon.

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KudzuRunner
Cool Runner
posted Jun-05-2006 02:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KudzuRunner   Click Here to Email KudzuRunner     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
StCroix:

Big congrats! It's always nice to achieve objectives through hard work, patient application--and sheer unexpected grace. I, too, have had success at unexpected times in my training cycle, although this last time through the success came precisely when it was supposed to, in a set of back-to-back 10Ks (41:08, 40:48) on successive weekends.

Continued good luck to you.

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brook trout
Cool Runner
posted Jun-05-2006 02:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for brook trout   Click Here to Email brook trout     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Good job, St. Croix! I had been wondering where you went

I don't know what your next level goal is, but I've started a sub-6/mike/5K thread if you care to join. It's a leap from a sub-20, sure, but we've got time.

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brook trout

my profile

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bradvabeach
Member
posted Jun-07-2006 12:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for bradvabeach   Click Here to Email bradvabeach     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

MaineRunner2001 - Your training schedule sounds like almost exactly what I did in fall 05, except I did 3 mile tempos at 6:50-7:00. I missed my goal with a 20:12
This spring I upped the milage to 40mpw with 2 hard workouts per week. Still failed. I'll try again next fall.
I think one thing I did wrong is only trying only one race each time. Too much pressure to perform with all your eggs in one basket...
Brad

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MaineRunner2001
Cool Runner
posted Jun-07-2006 01:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MaineRunner2001     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I know what you mean by putting all your eggs in one basket. Course selection is key. There is a spring 5K close to me that is flat. Every other race I have found near me is hilly and tough. I don't have a chance at sub 20 on those. I still race them though.

The 5K I'm running in August is semi fast, but the heat/humidity can be a challenge. I'm hoping for rain!


quote:
Originally posted by bradvabeach:

MaineRunner2001 - Your training schedule sounds like almost exactly what I did in fall 05, except I did 3 mile tempos at 6:50-7:00. I missed my goal with a 20:12
This spring I upped the milage to 40mpw with 2 hard workouts per week. Still failed. I'll try again next fall.
I think one thing I did wrong is only trying only one race each time. Too much pressure to perform with all your eggs in one basket...
Brad

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schamberlin
Member
posted Jun-11-2006 12:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for schamberlin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'll add my two cents as well: I'm a 35-year-old male, been running for about four years. A sub-20 5K has been a big goal of mine for most of that time. I came pretty close in 2004, running as fast as 20:26, but then slacked off for a while. In the past year I've been running more like 21-22 minutes, and haven't been under 21:00 in more than a year.

I've had a few months of great training recently, with slowly increasing mileage up to the mid 50's per week. I ran a PR 10K two weeks ago that suggested a sub-20 5K might once again be within striking distance. Today I put that to the test at a local 5K race.

First mile was 6:28, just about perfect, but I was already feeling some distress. I struggled through the second mile in 6:39, before regrouping a little and taking the third mile in 6:32. I managed to make up a few seconds in a sprint during the final tenth, and finished in 20:17. No sub-20, but still a new PR, and by far the best 5K I've run in two years. I'll take another shot at sub-20 next month in a 5000 meter track race. I'll post again if I manage to crack the elusive sub-20 nut.

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itano
Cool Runner
posted Jun-11-2006 08:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for itano   Click Here to Email itano     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I can see the appeal of a goal with a nice round number, like a 20-minute 5K or a 40-minute 10K, as opposed to just going for a PR. It's an absolute standard that you can use to measure yourself against others. The trouble is, a 20 minute 5K is just not a realistic goal for some of us. I didn't start running until after I was 50. I'm 55 now. If I could do sub-20, I'd be able to place in some of the local races.

On the other hand, going for an age-graded or age-equivalent 20 minutes is a reasonable goal. By the time this occurred to me, though, I'd already accomplished it. So it was kind of anticlimactic. My 22:32 time at age 54 is equivalent to a 19:05 for a young person according to the 2006 WMA tables. On the other hand, a sub-equivalent-40-minute 10K might be a reasonable goal for the next year.

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Wayne My User Profile

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