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Morton's Neuroma ARGH!


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nailgun
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posted Aug-14-2007 11:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for nailgun     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have what i think is a neuroma between my first and second toe. been to pod did corti shot, then therapy. Corti worked short term then did thrapy for 4 weeks 2 - 3 times a week. expensive and only minor help. Then pod decided i needed custom orthotics to keep weight off of metatarsal area. been trying the orthots but causing me more pain in different areas of foot. Controlling original pain but causing even more pain..not happy. Went back to pod who made an adjustment to orthotic ( 3 weeks for a felt pad ) still unable to wear orthotic for more than 4 hours and the adjustment pad keeps moving i have to unstick it and put it back where i think he placed it.....
going back to pod tomorrow to discuss........
also have an appointment next week at a cryo place by me.....
I think my whole problem was originally caused by nike shox shoes which were to narrow but will never know..........
let you know how i make out.......

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runawayjesse
Cool Runner
posted Aug-14-2007 03:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for runawayjesse     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm telling you, guys posture control insoles are wher it's at. I have sufferend with neruroma for years and years. I have been through it all injections etc...Doctors know nothing about this. At least give the site a read.

Most people have Mortons neuroma bacuase their first metersel is either raised or short. The solution is as simple as getting the groud to that metersal eariler in the gait cycle. Bingo you no longer pinch that nerve anymore. No lie I haven't had pain since I tried these things and that was over a year ago. In fact I forget what MN even feels like. At least give this site a read-
http://www.posturedyn.com/posturecontrolinsoles.html

And I swear I have nothing to do with this vendor. I'm just simple amazed with this product!

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ShelleyM
Cool Runner
posted Aug-14-2007 04:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ShelleyM   Click Here to Email ShelleyM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
runawayjesse-I have wasted so much money on insoles, that I hesitate to try another one. I spent $300.00 on the Mr. Goodfeet insoles, not to mention what I have spent on insoles when I was able to run. If these injections don't work, I will probably try the insoles. Do you know if they fit in regular shoes or just athletic shoes?

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runawayjesse
Cool Runner
posted Aug-14-2007 05:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for runawayjesse     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
they fit in all shoes. read the Faq on that site. Read the theory's behind them. I'm telling you they aren't just insoles.

If you want to see if they might work try this-

Take a pad of some sort and tape it uder your FIRST metersel(I'm spelling that wrong)head. Thats is under the ball of the foot ONLY. Make sure not to raise the other metersels. try it maybe 3 mm think. You can use mole skin or even just a peice of an old sockliner from an old shoe. You can tape it under your sockliner of your shoe but make sure it only raises the first metersel.

Mortons foot see here-
http://www.mortonsfoot.com/yourfoot.html

Is usually when you have one of two things going on. 1) the second metersel(not toe) is longer the the first. This causes that bone to hit the ground before the first and continues to roll as the first one looks for the ground. Thish pushes on your nerves. Or 2) a raised first metersel. This causes the foot to continue to roll as the big toe joint looks for the ground. By the time it gets their the other toes get all smooshed. Also the second and third metersels aren't built to take that kinda load. By the time the first one gets to the ground the other ones already did more than their share of the work. This is usually chartized as "forefoot overpronation". to make matters worse stability shoes lift the medial side of your foot in the rear lifting that toe joint even higher. The idea is to put something under that big toe joint so that it hits the ground earlier in the gait cycle. As you foot rolls in and that toe hits the ground your arches and calfs tighten stoipping that rolling action. Basicle you improve proprioception. To se what I'm talking about try it barefooted. Put something under your big toe joint and walk. Notice at what point in the gait cycle your arches and calf muscles tense.

The whole idea is based on Neuromuscular Motion Control-
http://www.posturedyn.com/faq.html#Q19

Anyways I started getting mortons neruma at age 12. I delt with it till I was 26 (last year). Injections, pads, orthotics, nothing worked. When I first got these and brought them to my Doctor he exclaimed- "yeah this might work". No word of lie they put an end instantly to 14 years worth of pain. I'm talking limping by the end of everyday. It's almost funny that such a simple remedy worked. i have been through at least 20 doctors(really) and yet no relief.

Today I just use a simple pad under that toe joint but I started with these insoles. I guess Neuromuscular Motion Control isn't a medical practice as of yet.

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bboywannabe
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posted Aug-15-2007 03:14 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for bboywannabe     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
nailgun

here here. It was damn nike asics that gave me my neuroma. That entire shoe line has their sizes way off. In all fairness, I shouldn't of tried to break em in.

I haven't read much about how neuromas start from uneven metatarsals. I'm sure if that's someones problem, these insoles would help.

I always thought the majority of the incidents came from tight footwear that squeezed the nerve through the metatarsals.

Insoles would never help me because that means I have to wear shoes. Any kinda shoes, no matter how small the constriction, will cause pain for me. The only thing i can wear is sandals, because the toes are open.

Once again though, I have read about people having problems with mere steps. If you can't even walk barefoot, where there is no constriction, then insoles may help you. Impact doesn't bother me at all, it's only constriction.

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ShelleyM
Cool Runner
posted Aug-15-2007 05:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for ShelleyM   Click Here to Email ShelleyM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My pod told me it is probably my developing bunion that is causing my 2nd toe to get too close to the 3rd, which in turned started the neuroma. I have tried metatarsal pads, several types. I agree on the constriction of the shoes. Yesterday, the pod asked me if I am wearing my athletic shoes and doing everything I am supposed to (not going barefoot.) I haven't been wearing them because I am so much more comfortable in flip flops with no constriction. Today I am wearing the shoes and am hoping to be able to get through the day with them at work. Ugh!

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RunTimRun
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posted Aug-15-2007 12:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for RunTimRun   Click Here to Email RunTimRun     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jesse-

Thanks for the input. I think the idea behind this forum, in part, is to hear about what has worked and not worked. So I'm glad you have joined in.

I have seen the product you mentioned before and have thought about trying it. My podiatrist has said that the heart of my problem is a hyper-mobile 1st met, which leads to the raised condition you mentioned. Because the 1st is too "loose", the 2nd and 3rd are taking more of the impact than they should.

I think I will give them a try. I did notice they have a 100% money back guarantee. My pod. is thinking about fusing the 1st met, which I want to avoid at all cost, so I think it is worth a try.

As far as my present treatment, I have my 5th & last alchohol injection tomorrow. They have been 3-4 days apart. He said it would take about a month to see how things respond. Right now, because of the frequent injections, I feel like I have a marble under my foot when I walk.

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RunTimRun
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posted Aug-15-2007 12:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for RunTimRun   Click Here to Email RunTimRun     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jesse- Did you run with these, and if so, how much?

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runawayjesse
Cool Runner
posted Aug-15-2007 05:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for runawayjesse     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by RunTimRun:
Jesse- Did you run with these, and if so, how much?


Yeah a little over 1000 miles. Wore them in my work shoes which I actually use to work....on my feet all day. The only caveat is they caused a little blister on my big toe. I just wraped duct tape around it.

Anyways rather than buy a new pair I tried an experiement. I just taped a little peice of firm fabric under my sock liner right under the big toe joint. It worked!!

The thing I didn't understand about the insoles is that it is a must that you wear them in both shoes. After tallking with the folks at mortons foot they inststed on it. They couldn't understand that I had mortons foot only in the one foot. They insisted it should be in both feet or I don't have it at all. I have a TRUE leg length discrepency and my longer leg compensated by lifting the first metersel of that foot. Kinda like when I walk that foot is trying to push through the ground and my big toe is trying to protect itself. This caaused the other meterseals to smoosh together. Like I said I have tried everything, nothing worked.

Anyways if you read that site you will see they correct a varity of mechanical defects. They are the exact opposite of orthotics. While orthotics support your feet these work to strengthen your OWN supporting muscles. I personelly know many runners who have used them with great success.

Check the message boards over at runnersworld. Their is lots of folks in the "shoe" forum raving about them. Look for a guy that goes by the name BBK. He turned me onto them and will be able to tell you a lot more than myself.

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ShelleyM
Cool Runner
posted Aug-16-2007 05:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for ShelleyM   Click Here to Email ShelleyM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You talked me into it. I just ordered them. Hopefully they will help. If not, it will just be another lesson learned.

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runawayjesse
Cool Runner
posted Aug-16-2007 07:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for runawayjesse     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ShelleyM:
You talked me into it. I just ordered them. Hopefully they will help. If not, it will just be another lesson learned.

I believe they offer a 100% money back garuntee.

I was thinking about what you said about the bunion. If you have a bunion sticking out on the side of your foot thats a sure sighn you are overpronating in the forefoot. If you overpronate in the forefoot their is no doubt you will get a neuroma.

BTW- What size did you order the 3.5 m/m or the 6 m/m?

Also don't be nervouse because your doctors never heard of them. Doctors tend to be trained to treat the symptoms(i.e injections)and care little about the cause. If the cause isn't fixed it will keep coming back(at least from my experience). Their is no money in neuromuscular motion control so it's not a surprise doctors don't use it as treatment. For example I was at the Pod and orthopedic at least once per month + physical thearpy on a weekly bases for nearly 14 years. Since I purshased these I didn't have to go since(thats over a year). Their is no reason to go behind your doctors back. Let them know that you want to try these. Bring them in and get an opinion but don't be afraid to try.


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RunTimRun
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posted Aug-16-2007 10:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for RunTimRun   Click Here to Email RunTimRun     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I ordered them too. Got the 3.5

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runawayjesse
Cool Runner
posted Aug-16-2007 11:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for runawayjesse     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I urge you guys who bought them to read a little about them too. Don't just throw them in your shoes. Well, thats what I did and it worked fine. Since they will trigger muscles that you may have neglacted for years it can lead to a case of DOMS for some. You have to remember it is a change and you may need to adapt. Consider walking around in them for a week before putting them into your trainers.

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ShelleyM
Cool Runner
posted Aug-17-2007 04:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for ShelleyM   Click Here to Email ShelleyM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jesse-I ordered the 3.5 also. Thanks for the tips. What is DOMS?

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Elizabeth78
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posted Aug-17-2007 11:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Elizabeth78     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I am glad I found this thread. I have two Morton's Neruomas on both sides of my middle toe in my left foot! It makes it hard to use the thing you place in the running shoe to support one of them, because then that crushes the other! I got my first injections today (two, side by side) and my doctor said I would start feeling relief after the 2nd or 3rd time. I'm numb at the moment probably because the shot also had Lidocaine, I am guessing.

I've had to cancel my Chicago Marathon because I haven't been able to run for 3 weeks! And it's peak training. Two different doctors mis-diagnosed it as a stress fracture, but the pain kept getting worse and worse, so I finally had an MRI.

I wish they found this when I first went to the doctor over three weeks ago, because then the Neuroma wouldn't have gotten so big. And I could have started the shots earlier.

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robutrunner
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posted Aug-17-2007 02:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for robutrunner     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I had cyrosurgery 6 weeks ago for Morton's Neuroma. I have suffered with this condition for over 5 years and have tried every pad, insert and type of shoe known to man to help this condition. I located a doctor in The UK who does this procedure [cryosurgery] because I did not want to go through with traditional surgery . The whole procedure was pain-free and I was back doing normal things with 2 days. For anyone who is totally fed up with Morton's Neuroma, I would totally recommend this procedure.

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bboywannabe
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posted Aug-18-2007 02:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for bboywannabe     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Great news robutrunner. You've given me some more hope.

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robutrunner
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posted Aug-18-2007 09:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for robutrunner     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I am glad this was helpful, bboy.
I know it is still early days following my cryosurgery but I am optimistic. Like Dr. Katz in Tampa, The Pod who did my procedure said that I had no relief , he would perform the procedure again, free of charge.
Good luck to you in finding a way out of the pain of neuroma.

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ShelleyM
Cool Runner
posted Aug-18-2007 04:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ShelleyM   Click Here to Email ShelleyM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Jesse-I received my inserts today. Should I wear them on top of the shoe insert that already is in the shoe or underneath? The instructions are not all that clear. I don't think they'll fit in my regular shoes (dress ones.) I thought I'd give them a try tomorrow around the house.

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RunTimRun
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posted Aug-18-2007 05:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for RunTimRun   Click Here to Email RunTimRun     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Shelley-

I got mine yesterday and wondered the same thing, so I called customer service. They said to put them under the insole that came with your shoe. If it's too tight, you can leave out the one from the manufacturer, but they recommend you leave it in if the fit is ok, for the extra cushioning.

Mine have felt good. My foot is still swollen & sore from the injections, so I do not yet know how it will do. But I have less pain with these insoles than I do with my orthotics. I am encouraged so far.

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ShelleyM
Cool Runner
posted Aug-18-2007 07:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ShelleyM   Click Here to Email ShelleyM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks, Tim. I'll try it that way. I have them on top right now.

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runawayjesse
Cool Runner
posted Aug-18-2007 11:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for runawayjesse     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As it reads on the faq you should put them under your sockliner. If that makes the shoe too tight then just use them alone(thats what I did). Also they should be cut to fit your shoes. Use the guide they send you.

Keep me posted.

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ShelleyM
Cool Runner
posted Aug-20-2007 05:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for ShelleyM   Click Here to Email ShelleyM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I wore the inserts most of yesterday and they seemed good. Today, I am trying them in my dress sandals, but luckily my pants cover the fact that they don't fit in them well. After I walked quite a bit yesterday though, my foot was screaming to get out of the shoe.

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runawayjesse
Cool Runner
posted Aug-22-2007 05:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for runawayjesse     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
So hows it goin?

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RunTimRun
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posted Aug-23-2007 12:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for RunTimRun   Click Here to Email RunTimRun     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Not much change for me. Still have swelling & pain from the injections. It's been a week since the last one (I had 5 injections 3-4 days apart). Today seems to be a little better though.

I have a little less pain when wearing the Morton's Foot insoles than with my orthotics, but it's too early to tell how effective they will be. I have had a little pain in my knees this week that I am sure is just a matter of adjusting to the reorientation of my feet. Nothing consequential.

I'm still hopeful.

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