posted Nov-06-2006 05:58 PM            

I'm actually going to be in California the rest of the week on business - getting back Friday night (moderately late). That's the main reason I haven't signed up for Old Reliable yet. If I do sign up, it will be for the 10k. I've surpassed my goals for the fall for the 5k, and the Inside-Out 10k has me tasting that one hour mark.

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posted Nov-06-2006 07:27 PM               

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posted Nov-06-2006 09:00 PM            

Bitbit, congratulations on your marathon! Your getting stronger each race.

Brook: The main cause of cramps is dehydration. You did well to finish in your condition. Many people would have quit.

Well I went to see a Neurosurgeon about my pinched nerve in my neck a few weeks ago and he said running was my main cause. He recommended pool work instead on running and said that my marathon days are over. He also said biking is excellent if I position my seat and handle bars so my neck is not bent much--I have. Since my visit to him I have increased my shoulder/neck exercises and rested my back when possible and my pain in 99% gone. After four months, I and now pain free.

The foot doctor said the same about running when he saw the heel spurs on each foot and the arthritis on the left ankle. My PF still hurts after being on my feet too long or after some runs. It is getting better, but we are not there yet.

So I have decided to keep my running to a minimum say two times a week maybe 3-6 miles each run. I now bike more and I am taking up swimming to fill the gaps. I decided I’ll do my first triathlon next spring. I’ll pick up the running as my PF heals more. Not sure I’ll do another marathon. I would like to work on getting my 5k speed back next year. I plan on continuing with my neck and shoulder exercises to protect my neck from further damage. No more races this year. I am happy to see how well many you are doing in your races. I miss doing them.

As much as I love Umstead, downhill running is the worse for my feet and neck, so I probably won’t be out there running, but be riding my mountain bike. Now the ATT in Wake is perfect for running, so you will see me there!

By the way, the work on the ATT extension continues. Soon we will have a trail from Humie Olive in Wake to Durham--about 22 miles.

Jay, your getting close. Take it easy before your race. You are ready.

Bob

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posted Nov-07-2006 10:57 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by JasonsDrivingForce:
I will be there. However, I will be running in the 10K jogging stroller division as long as the weather is good. The course change should not matter that much. The course is pretty flat either way. Are you doing the 5K or the 10K? Remember when you see the capital in the 10K it is all downhill from there. It is about 1.50 miles from the finish but you really can make up a lot of time on that last stretch.

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My husband and I are doing the 10K - it'll be our first time doing this distance. We've done 5K's but wanted to push ourselves a little more. From what I've heard, it seems to be a relatively easy course. I'm excited for it and hoping for good weather!

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posted Nov-07-2006 11:38 AM            

Ok so I had a pretty comfortable lead in my age group for the 2nd empire series until the nike 5k on Sunday. I lead by 47 points until the second place guy burned it up on Sunday. By my calculations I now have a slim 16 point lead which is about 20 seconds per 5K at our pace. The question is do I run with the double jogger for the Turkey Trot. I am pretty confident that I could leave the stroller at home and secure the 1st place age group win. However, my goal was to win the series with the stroller. Now if the weather is not good then I won’t run with the stroller anyway. However, if it is a nice day and I don’t run with my son, he will be disappointed. The new course is going to be challenging. Those long hills will destroy me with the double stroller.

So what would you do? Go for the challenge or take the easy way out and wrap up the victory? See you at the race where you can see if I wussed out or not!

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posted Nov-07-2006 01:52 PM            

Thanks for checking in. I have been wondering about you!

I am so glad to hear that you are pain free and back to doing some shorter runs. With all the biking and now swimming, you should be ready for tri season next year. Who knows, maybe you will enjoy that even more than marathoning.

Wow, I had no idea the ATT was going to extend that far. I have been running the ATT instead of Umstead lately, since it's so much closer to home!

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posted Nov-07-2006 02:00 PM               

Regardless, I'm glad you've found other things to fill the niche, and it's good that you're keeping in touch with the running. Hey, you can still bike out in Umstead (just don't careen carelessly down the N. Turkey Creek hills at 40mph, ok?).

JDF - tough call. It depends on what I'd win 1st vs. 2nd . In either case, you get a nice banquet at the end, no? FWIW, the chatter that goes on around you when you with your stroller would be ego inflating if you could here it - folks are definitely impressed with your stroller pushing exploits, so, personally, I think to place with the stroller would be more impressive!

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posted Nov-07-2006 02:08 PM               

You folks who run it regularly, can you tell me if the mile markers are accurate? Also, is there any incline/decline at all, or is it literally flat from one end to the other? The Creeper course has a very slight grade, though it adds up over many miles, so I'd love to run on something similar if possible.

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posted Nov-07-2006 03:17 PM            

http://www.gmap-pedometer.com/?r=531542

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posted Nov-07-2006 03:52 PM            

BrookTrout, are you going to be in town on Thanksgiving Day? I would love someone to pace off of. I know it is a little shorter than you like(8K) but it is actually a pretty fun race. If I can keep up with you then I should be able to get the victory.

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posted Nov-07-2006 06:00 PM            

ATT is flat mostly, but it has these very long slow rises you cannot see, but your time is increased. From mile marker 1.0 to 2.0 is a slow rise that increases my mile time by 30 seconds on average. Mile marker 3.5 to 5.0 has a slow rise with the same time increase per mile--maybe slightly worse. I have not measured the mile markers, but I feel they are accurate from checking my time to the markers week in and week out.

See you out there Saturday.

Bob

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posted Nov-07-2006 06:33 PM               

Bob, thanks for the info - just what I wanted to hear. I'm glad that there are gentle inclines/declines - just like the Creeper course.

I ran six miles in Umstead and was cruising along at about 8:00 minute pace when all of a sudden a couple of local college runners (I assume that they were college runners - they weren't just fitness runners, that's fer sure) came cruising by! I decided to run with them for a bit. They were keeping about a 6:30 pace, and conversing while doing so. I ran with them for about 1/2 a mile before I had to turn off.

It was interesting to see that they're cadence, stride, etc. was the same as mine. They weren't exerting as much effort at that pace as I was, but it wasn;t like they were jogging, either. On TV - it looks like the real fast runners are all just jogging. Close up, it doesn't look that way - it looks much faster in person. One of the guys was obviously an East African (look, accent) and the other was an Asian - both looked about 20.

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posted Nov-07-2006 08:39 PM            

[This message has been edited by greenehouse (edited Nov-07-2006).]

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posted Nov-08-2006 09:13 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by greenehouse:
Hi everyone - first time poster here - have enjoyed reading the stories and advice from fellow Raleigh runners. Just thought I'd say "hello". I'm going to take a crack at the Old Reliable 10K on Sunday - maybe will see some of you out there. [ Will keep an eye out for the wild man with double stroller. ] Cheers!

[This message has been edited by greenehouse (edited Nov-07-2006).]

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Welcome, greenehouse! The old reliable is definitely a great race to run. It is basically a flat course. It should be a great race. The weather will be perfect! 63 and Sunny! Just look for the big yellow stroller and you will know me. Come say hi.

Oh yea and for the record, Jason is my son. I am Travis. Since I push him in the stroller I thought JasonsDrivingForce was appropriate. I think there has been some confusion as to what my name was. I guess technically I should have changed it to JasonAndSammy_BsDrivingForce with the birth of my daughter but that is too long.

Hope everyone has a great race on Sunday!

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posted Nov-08-2006 10:42 AM               

Would you recommend your foot doc? If so, could I have his/her name/office (you can send to the email in my profile if you don't want to post it here).

I should probably go and get my left foot checked. It's been sore for about a month now - never really gets worse but isn't getting better, either. It's the outside of my left foot. It's hard to pinpoint the pain, but I can feel a bit of discomfort when I push in the bony protuberence of the fifth metatarsal. I'm guessing it's tendonitis of that 'stirrup' tendon, but figure I ought to find out for sure.

The pain does go away after either walking or unning for about 10 seconds. That's consistent with PF, right? If it were PF, though, wouldn't I feel it more in my arch?

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posted Nov-08-2006 10:46 AM            

I find it amazing to see fast runners in a race make it look so easy, but when you run with them you get an eye opener.

6:30 pace in Umstead is a killer pace.

Out biking for lunch. I have a course laid that goes out on a seldom used country road in Apex area--but I have to travel down Highway 55 for a hundred yards to get to it! It is hilly, which makes it a challenge.

Bob

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posted Nov-08-2006 11:53 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by RunBobaluRun:
Sorry for the mistake on the name Travis.

I find it amazing to see fast runners in a race make it look so easy, but when you run with them you get an eye opener.

6:30 pace in Umstead is a killer pace.

Bob

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Don’t worry about the name thing. I was just trying to clarify that.

Yes it is pretty amazing how guys like Devon hold that 4:50 pace for so long. Brook, you must be getting quite fast! Holding a 6:30 for a distance is great. Are you going to do anymore races before your creeper run?

I almost ran that 1 mile race this weekend to see if I am even capable of one sub 5:00/mile. I looked at the winning time and it was 4:16! That is flying! Glad I didn’t run it now. However, I was pleased with a 5:32 with the double even if I was basically being dragged down the hill by my two kids. I was still able to stand after that mile and I got them back up that hill.

Well, I gotta run, literally(off for my lunchtime 6.2).

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posted Nov-08-2006 12:00 PM               

Sure, I'll race before the Creeper, but I need to find out what's wrong with my foot before I try to run fast again.

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posted Nov-08-2006 12:27 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by brook trout:
I only ran with those guys for about 1/2 mile. I can hold 6:20 for 5K, that's about it for now

Sure, I'll race before the Creeper, but I need to find out what's wrong with my foot before I try to run fast again.

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Brook,
I hope your foot gets better.

6:20 for a 5K is pretty good. You seem to do better at the longer distances. Is that because of your training? Speaking of training, I am really leaving this time.

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posted Nov-08-2006 12:49 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by JasonsDrivingForce:
Brook,
I hope your foot gets better.

6:20 for a 5K is pretty good. You seem to do better at the longer distances. Is that because of your training? Speaking of training, I am really leaving this time.

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Actually, my times scale up pretty well, accoding to the calculators. The problem is that I have only average foot speed, so that's a hard limiter that I can't really train through.

You, OTOH, I think are top heavy with speed. You're 5Ks with the stroller are better than your recent 10 miler, sans stroller, iirc. So, unless, somehow, the stroller actually improves your 5K speed (which I can;t imagine), then you have lots of undeveloped potential at the longer distances!

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[This message has been edited by brook trout (edited Nov-08-2006).]

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posted Nov-08-2006 04:08 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by brook trout:
Actually, my times scale up pretty well, accoding to the calculators. The problem is that I have only average foot speed, so that's a hard limiter that I can't really train through.

You, OTOH, I think are top heavy with speed. You're 5Ks with the stroller are better than your recent 10 miler, sans stroller, iirc. So, unless, somehow, the stroller actually improves your 5K speed (which I can;t imagine), then you have lots of undeveloped potential at the longer distances!

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Yes I am actually impressed by your endurance. I couldn’t come close to keeping up with you during the last few miles of the Patrol Stroll. I think I would trade a little foot speed for some of that endurance right now. Especially with all of these 8K and 10K races coming up.

You know I have been actually wondering if the stroller might actually be a benefit in certain situations. For one I know it is a benefit in training. I got so used to pushing that stroller that I had built up some pretty good leg strength. I haven’t trained with it in over 1 month and I can already feel the difference. My legs were destroyed after the hills in the Nike race. There is also the fact that I do support some of my weight with the stroller. I know I can sprint faster downhill with the double jogger than I can without it. It kind of drags you down the hill. So in the two races that were what I consider flat(2nd empire and especially the autism) I was able to do several stretch’s at very high speeds without the penalties of a very steep hill. So in a way I guess some would say that the stroller is actually an advantage on certain courses.

I ran the same course today that I used to run with the double jogger. It has a lot of rolling hills. I was over 1:10 slower today without the stroller than my previous best with the stroller. That tells you a lot since I have increased my mpw from 3 when I set that pb on the course to over 20 now! Now if I could only get 30+ mpw in with the stroller then “look out”.

Oh yea my 10 mile time was slow because I was trying to see what I could do for the 10K. I had a 41:30 for the first 10K, then I backed way off for the last 4 miles. I knew I hadn't trained enough to get a good time in the 10 miler and I didn't want to hurt myself.

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posted Nov-08-2006 04:51 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by JasonsDrivingForce:
I couldn’t come close to keeping up with you during the last few miles of the Patrol Stroll. I

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Yes, but I wasn't pushing a couple kids!

The marathon training should smooth out any endurance deficiencies that you may (or may not) have, and your natural speed should allow you to do quite well if you get in the training.

I have a buddy who's a real speedster (4:25-4:30 miler in H.S. and 1:56 800 meter guy in college - he;'s 35 now). He ran the Marine Corp marathon recently on half assed training (a couple months of 30 mile weeks, much of that coming in a single run), ran the entire way without drinking or taking in any carbs ("hey, I didn't do it in training and they say nothing new on race day!") and finished in 3:12 on a tough, windy day.

He destroyed me by almost a minute in a 5K with almost no training at all.

Natural speed is good. Not sure you're quite as fast as him, but you do seem to have the gift of above average raw speed!

He's going to run Boston this year, probably. He's one of those guys that could run well under three if he puts his mind to it, which he probably won't!

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posted Nov-08-2006 05:03 PM            

Good bike ride during lunch--misty, but not a problem. Running day tomorrow. Look forward to it.

Bob

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posted Nov-09-2006 02:00 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by brook trout:
Yes, but I wasn't pushing a couple kids!

The marathon training should smooth out any endurance deficiencies that you may (or may not) have, and your natural speed should allow you to do quite well if you get in the training.

I have a buddy who's a real speedster (4:25-4:30 miler in H.S. and 1:56 800 meter guy in college - he;'s 35 now). He ran the Marine Corp marathon recently on half assed training (a couple months of 30 mile weeks, much of that coming in a single run), ran the entire way without drinking or taking in any carbs ("hey, I didn't do it in training and they say nothing new on race day!") and finished in 3:12 on a tough, windy day.

He destroyed me by almost a minute in a 5K with almost no training at all.

Natural speed is good. Not sure you're quite as fast as him, but you do seem to have the gift of above average raw speed!

He's going to run Boston this year, probably. He's one of those guys that could run well under three if he puts his mind to it, which he probably won't!

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Look at Armstrong. He is considered the fittest athlete on the planet by some(or at least he was in his hay day). He managed a sub 3:00 at Boston with some pretty weak training. I wonder what he could do if he put his mind to it. A lot of people didn’t care that Armstrong could do a sub 3 on very little training. I would love to see Paul Tergat try to ride even one stage of the tour de France. If he could average his same 4:50 per mile over that stage on a bike I would be amazed and that would put him dead last by many many hours! He would probably get 50 miles into it and his legs would simply fall apart. It is pretty amazing how some guys can be competitive in two totally unrelated sports. I have the utmost respect for triathletes. I guess for some people it just comes naturally.

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posted Nov-09-2006 08:46 AM               

We're in:

http://www.runtricities.org/asp/vcm_reglist.asp

!

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