posted Sep-22-2005 10:09 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by leitnerj:
Well, I can just tolerate a lot of mileage now, but that's
only because in training, I'm hardly working rather than
working hard!

Oh, LEITNER.....your being modest!!

---

posted Sep-22-2005 10:14 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by leitnerj:
Well, I can just tolerate a lot of mileage now, but that's
only because in training, I'm hardly working rather than
working hard!

Leitner, Leitner, Leitner.....your being modest!!!! What I'd give to have the drive, no-how, and aerobic capacity you have!!!!

---

posted Sep-23-2005 06:37 AM            

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posted Sep-23-2005 10:43 AM            

I had to take an inhaler before I left to run, and I'm suspecting that made my HR higher. It was chilly, and I was looking forward to staying at 135....it just didn't work. Most of the time my HR just wanted to stay from 142-145.....

What I did notice is that my HR watch said I burned more calories, than when I run in the lower 130's. Still, I didn't like keeping my HR that high for a 1 1/2 hour run. And, consequently, by the time I reached the driveway, I was wheezing.

Maybe tomorrow will be a better day.
 

posted Sep-23-2005 12:34 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Boston124:
I did not have a good MAFF run this a.m .

I had to take an inhaler before I left to run, and I'm suspecting that made my HR higher. It was chilly, and I was looking forward to staying at 135....it just didn't work. Most of the time my HR just wanted to stay from 142-145.....

What I did notice is that my HR watch said I burned more calories, than when I run in the lower 130's. Still, I didn't like keeping my HR that high for a 1 1/2 hour run. And, consequently, by the time I reached the driveway, I was wheezing.

Maybe tomorrow will be a better day.

---

Hi Boston! I did a 20 miler this morning. It was miserable
and I knew is was going to be. The dew point was 64 when I
left with temp 75, and it went up to 88 with the same dew
point. I knew it would just like my run last Friday, although
it wasn't quite as bad (dew point was 70 a week ago). Always
look at the temp/dewpoint when you go out - you'll notice how
good of a predictor it's going to be.

Oh, by the way, don't trust the calorie calculator in your watch
unless your watch has a GPS receiver in it and knows what
the inclines were, how much you weigh, and how far you've
gone. Without that information, it's little better than a random
guess.

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posted Sep-23-2005 01:30 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by StealthRunner:
.... So, I feel that sometimes you need to take a step backwards before you can go forwards. IMHO anyway.

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Amen - This is ALL about patience.
 

posted Sep-23-2005 03:01 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by StealthRunner:
Hi Boston- Sorry to hear about your bad run. It happens to us all at some point in time. Just a thought... I had gone out the other day for a nice run. It turned out to be one of those bad days. The ole HR monitor was just about ready to be thrown into the local Arroyo. (a wash) I wasn't able to keep the HR down, so I ended up bagging the run. The next day I was able to run much longer with my HR under MAF. So, I feel that sometimes you need to take a step backwards before you can go forwards. IMHO anyway.

---

The dew point was low....probably none. It was cool-n-crisp! I did wear running shorts, a dry-fit top, and a warm hoodie. The wind was whippy at times and I had to fight it here-n-there. But, I do think it was the Albuterol Inaher that I took moments before I ran that caused my HR to ride up. I was wheezing for quite awhile after I pulled in the driveway. I felt fine otherwise.

Actually, I felt my *effort* was that at the lower HR. I wasn't breathing harder....just the monitor showed the increase. I can usually tell now by just my breathing what HR I'm running at.

Leitner, your bursting my bubble!!! I was all excited about the extra calorie burn, and YOU ruined it !!!! Okay, I'm kidding, I'm not mad!! Just wanted to get on you a bit!!!!

Have a great weekend, everyone!

posted Sep-23-2005 05:20 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Boston124:

Leitner, your bursting my bubble!!! I was all excited about the extra calorie burn, and YOU ruined it !!!! Okay, I'm kidding, I'm not mad!! Just wanted to get on you a bit!!!!

Have a great weekend, everyone!

---

I burst everyone's bubble. Just in the last two weeks, I've had
4 people who have been asking me questions via email tell me
that they won't be talking to me anymore because I burst their
bubbles, too! I tell it like I think it is and I'm probably more on the
discouraging side for many.

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posted Sep-23-2005 05:33 PM         

quote:

---

Originally posted by leitnerj:
I burst everyone's bubble. Just in the last two weeks, I've had
4 people who have been asking me questions via email tell me
that they won't be talking to me anymore because I burst their
bubbles, too! I tell it like I think it is and I'm probably more on the
discouraging side for many.

---

Not mine. I think you're great. Just keep telling it like it is!

posted Sep-23-2005 05:55 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by StealthRunner:

Not mine. I think you're great. Just keep telling it like it is!

---

Thanks SR - I'll at least tell it like I think it is! (best I can do)

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posted Sep-23-2005 06:01 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Boston124:
The dew point was low....probably none. It was cool-n-crisp! I did wear running shorts, a dry-fit top, and a warm hoodie. The wind was whippy at times and I had to fight it here-n-there. But, I do think it was the Albuterol Inaher that I took moments before I ran that caused my HR to ride up. I was wheezing for quite awhile after I pulled in the driveway. I felt fine otherwise.

---

o' contrere - I don't think there's much secret that you're in Boston.
Currently, I see a dew point of 59 deg and it's very likely that this
morning it was up around 65 or so. Not the worst it could have been
but that's high enough to have a very significant effect.

Now, what's this warm hoodie stuff? I hope it was below 20 degrees,
which is how cold it has to be before you'd wear anything such as a
hoodie to run, unless you're in heavy training for the badwater 135
mile ultra in death valley! Incidentally, have you tried singulair and
advair? Neither of those have had any effect on my heart rate as
albuterol does.

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posted Sep-23-2005 10:45 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by leitnerj:
o' contrere - I don't think there's much secret that you're in Boston.
Currently, I see a dew point of 59 deg and it's very likely that this
morning it was up around 65 or so. Not the worst it could have been
but that's high enough to have a very significant effect.

Now, what's this warm hoodie stuff? I hope it was below 20 degrees,
which is how cold it has to be before you'd wear anything such as a
hoodie to run, unless you're in heavy training for the badwater 135
mile ultra in death valley! Incidentally, have you tried singulair and
advair? Neither of those have had any effect on my heart rate as
albuterol does.

---

LEITNER, DEAR MAN.....you should know by now that I live in ILLINOIS!!!! My BOSTON name, here, on the forum is used mainly to keep me encouraged to qualify for Boston!!!!

It was chilly this a.m. in ILLINOIS. I ran early. It was 60 if not cooler. We just finished a small heat wave. Yesterday it was 87 and awfully humid, and over night the whole weather scheme changed.

I like my hoodie, by-the-way! However, that BadWater Running is not for me!! I've read some articles on that run in Marathon and Beyond, and it's awesome.....just for reading, though.

I use Adviar 250/50, Singulair, Nasonex, Zyrtec D, and.....I'm trying to remember what else. Oh, weekly allergy shots, too! I don't think there is anything left!! I do alright, and complain with all the other health issues people deal with.

In this next year, I'm gonna improve running the Maff way, and someday I hope to see you at a marathon wearing a hoodie!!!!!

And.....you can keep bursting my bubble, I like honesty!!!!

posted Sep-24-2005 06:08 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Boston124:
LEITNER, DEAR MAN.....you should know by now that I live in ILLINOIS!!!! My BOSTON name, here, on the forum is used mainly to keep me encouraged to qualify for Boston!!!!

It was chilly this a.m. in ILLINOIS. I ran early. It was 60 if not cooler. We just finished a small heat wave. Yesterday it was 87 and awfully humid, and over night the whole weather scheme changed.

I like my hoodie, by-the-way! However, that BadWater Running is not for me!! I've read some articles on that run in Marathon and Beyond, and it's awesome.....just for reading, though.

I use Adviar 250/50, Singulair, Nasonex, Zyrtec D, and.....I'm trying to remember what else. Oh, weekly allergy shots, too! I don't think there is anything left!! I do alright, and complain with all the other health issues people deal with.

In this next year, I'm gonna improve running the Maff way, and someday I hope to see you at a marathon wearing a hoodie!!!!!

And.....you can keep bursting my bubble, I like honesty!!!!

---

ouch! you burst my bubble that time! Yeah, that's a lot of meds,
enough to drive any heart crazy! By the way, wearing a hoodie
in marathon will add 10 beats to your heart rate by mile 10, that's
a certainty. But it's good for heat training.

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posted Sep-24-2005 05:59 PM         

Thanks for giving us newbies a place to start.
 

posted Sep-24-2005 06:40 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by 3miles2go:
Can I just start by saying low-heartrate training ROCKS! Okay, now the explanation. I ran my first 5k in a very long time last June after finishing the Couch-to-5k. The course was flat, gravel and my first time actually running the full distance. I went out too fast, burned out 2/3 of the way in and then had to walk some before forcing myself into a quick jog for the finish line. Not a bad time for a first timer, but things could only improve after that. After that I worked my way through 3 mile runs and up to 4 mile run, but was really working hard and not enjoying myself all that much. That was when I got my HRM. I read a lot of this thread and started trying to run all my runs, which were essentially base-building, within the right ranges. I finished another 5k today after 8 weeks of HR training. This time I didn't go out too fast because I was able to pace myself by following my HR. There was a large and long hill that didn't even phase me. For the last mile I was able to increase my speed and then got a nice sprint in at the last strecth. When it was all over, I swear I could have ran some more. I found out my MaxHR is actually 208, higher than the 192 I estimated, and I will soon find out if I actually ran faster on the harder course than on the easier course.

Thanks for giving us newbies a place to start.

---

It's great to hear a good newbie story! Thanks for posting and
keep us updated.

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posted Sep-24-2005 10:58 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by leitnerj:
I burst everyone's bubble. Just in the last two weeks, I've had
4 people who have been asking me questions via email tell me
that they won't be talking to me anymore because I burst their
bubbles, too! I tell it like I think it is and I'm probably more on the
discouraging side for many.

---

I think the information you have provided in this thread has been invaluable. As a result of your information, I have purchased a heart rate monitor and always use it when I run or bike to keep within my MAF. Yes, it is hard on the ego at first but in my opinion, it is the perfect way to monitor one's progress.

In the article you posted from Mark Allen, he indicated that he used one for a full year to improve his aerobic base. If it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me.

I experienced far too many injuries by running without a heart rate monitor some of which still plague me today. But after running with a HRM now I feel refreshed and without the aches and pains I experienced previously. Sure some days aren't as good as others but that the nature of exercize.

Keep posting your advice. Many of us appreciate it and have benefited from it.

posted Sep-25-2005 06:19 PM            

Should this be a concern?

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posted Sep-25-2005 07:11 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Martlet:
After one week of MAF, I've noticed my split times aren't consistent.

Should this be a concern?

---

I wouldn't be concerned about anything at all after a week. Over
one week's time (and, in particular, the first week), anything can
happen. Maybe you can clarify what you mean by inconsistent.
For example, if split times go up and down over the first few miles,
keep in mind that until you're warmed up (possibly taking 2-3
miles to do so), you can bounce around a lot.

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posted Sep-25-2005 08:46 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by British Columbia Runner:

Keep posting your advice. Many of us appreciate it and have benefited from it.

---

Thanks for the feedback, I certainly enjoy the dialogue with
all of the posters here, it really helps put the pieces together.
Sometimes it seems that I may be overly negative, but it
seems to me better than misleading someone if I don't feel
that they're on the right track.

and back on subject ...
Well, it's taper time now - first race, 26.2 k (metric marathon)
next Sunday, followed by the triple on 10/6-8 ...

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posted Sep-27-2005 07:09 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by leitnerj:
I wouldn't be concerned about anything at all after a week. Over
one week's time (and, in particular, the first week), anything can
happen. Maybe you can clarify what you mean by inconsistent.
For example, if split times go up and down over the first few miles,
keep in mind that until you're warmed up (possibly taking 2-3
miles to do so), you can bounce around a lot.

---

I'll stick with it for a few weeks then post my splits.

Right now, they just jump around a lot. My last run they actually got faster as I ran.

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posted Sep-28-2005 01:24 AM            

Today, my legs still felt tired from a hard 22 miler on Sunday. I did a 9 mile recovery run maxing out at 138, and my legs felt great afterwards, much better than when I started. When I started I thought 5 was stretching it, but 9 came very easy. Last time I trained for a marathon, I kept my most of my recovery runs at 4-5 miles. I'm finding that if I keep in my Maffetone zone, I am able to build up the recovery days, and hence my weekly mileage (up to a peak of 72 so far--I peaked at 65 last time), and still feel like I've had a recovery run.

So, I'm kind of at half-Maff at this point, and it seems to be a wise way to get those extra aerobic miles in.

--Jimmy

Running Profile

posted Sep-28-2005 07:47 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by jjwaverly42:
I've been "going Maffy" on my recovery runs the past few weeks. I've been building up 2 weekly recovery runs to max out at 10 miles, so I thought I'd try my Maffetone zone of 141 BPM and below, instead of the Pfitzinger zone of 150 and below (I'm still using 135-165 for long and medium long runs, with 5 mile LT runs of 170-180, and 6x800m V02max intervals of 185-190).

Today, my legs still felt tired from a hard 22 miler on Sunday. I did a 9 mile recovery run maxing out at 138, and my legs felt great afterwards, much better than when I started. When I started I thought 5 was stretching it, but 9 came very easy. Last time I trained for a marathon, I kept my most of my recovery runs at 4-5 miles. I'm finding that if I keep in my Maffetone zone, I am able to build up the recovery days, and hence my weekly mileage (up to a peak of 72 so far--I peaked at 65 last time), and still feel like I've had a recovery run.

So, I'm kind of at half-Maff at this point, and it seems to be a wise way to get those extra aerobic miles in.

--Jimmy

Running Profile

---

Hey, this is GREAT! I'm glad MAFFETONE has found a place in your training. Keep-it-going, it will only benefit you more and more!

posted Sep-28-2005 10:56 AM            

So as stated before I am doing runs of
maff-15
maff-10
maff-5
maff
long run i vary

Well my maff = 135

Last week, and now this week when keeping my HR below 120 and 125 the fastest I can manage is a 6:00m/k
As soon as I go above 125 either 130 or 135 I can easily run a 5:30m/k. There is no slow graduation to this. I averaged 127 today @ 5:30 and 122 yesterday at 6:00. Conditions were very similar. Noticed the same thing last week. It almost seems like I should just do
Maff-10
Maff-10
Maff
Maff

long run is Maff-10 to Maff, varying.

Hmmm... interesting

David.

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